Brain posted this to his wall, but thought it would be good to share it out here and get wider feedback:
Discussion Item: I got this response from a good friend overseas after he watched the Chapter 7 video and a few others on my channel. If there’s one thing I know from doing this for five years, it’s that EVERYONE’s got an opinion they are convinced is the right one (yes, you MBN folks do it too, ha ha). I’m not looking for “Wow, he’s totally wrong, lose that friend!” I’m just looking for your thoughts on his advice.
*****
In my opinion you should stop doing [fly exercises]. They have very little benefit and for the amount of time they take you are better served using that time to do a compound exercise.
In fact, with the exception of maybe the rear delt fly (which will help promote a stable and healthy shoulder) I recommend you drop all of the isolation exercises (curls, leg extensions, over head tricep press, etc.). These exercises have very little benefit to your goal of losing weight and developing more muscle mass as they develop very little muscle mass.
Instead of isolation movements I would suggest filling your program exclusively with compound exercises as they will work more muscles in the same amount of time. Isolation exercises really can be helpful after you have developed a strong foundation in training and can be useful in correcting aesthetic issues or strength imbalances, but they are mostly a waste of time until you have developed a strong foundation.
My suggestion is to base your program around big compound exercises. The squat, the bench press, the standing overhead press, and the deadlift are all exercises that will help you develop a great deal of strength and muscle mass quickly. Use the leg press sparingly. Squat. Squat a lot. There is a reason it is called the king of exercises. Squatting frequently will bring you more results than ANY amount of leg presses, leg extensions, and leg curls. Lose the calf raises also, squats will make your calves big. I haven’t done a calf raise in 5 years and my calves are almost 20″.
Squat more. Do body weight squats. Got an extra 60 seconds do a set of 10 body weight squats. They add up throughout the day.
Barbell squat more. A lot more. Make it a personal goal to barbell squat 3 times a week. You don’t have to do a lot of weight, even just the bar if you want, but getting better at the squat will make you better at everything in life. Here is a sample starting squat routine:
Monday. 5 sets of 8 with just the bar
Wednesday. 8 sets of 1 with 75lbs (bar plus 15 on each side)
Friday. 3 sets of 3 with 95lbs (bar plus 25 on each side)
Each week add 10 lbs (first week would be 55lbs, 85lbs, 105lbs respectively).
Make sure you have good form and are squatting as deep as possible ass to grass or at least below parallel. Point your toes out 10 or 15 degrees and try driving your knees out to the side more, this will open your hips and give you room to get your body to get between your legs.
Bent over row
Bench press
Deadlift
Standing overhead press
SQUATS
Lunges
Pull ups (lat pull downs until you can do them)
Broad jumps
The above are all good examples of exercises you should be using as a foundation for your program. If you really want to do a fly, do a couple extra sets of bench press instead.
Ok I’m about to step off my soap box but u want to add one more thing, lose the crunch. The plank is a far more effective exercise for developing abdominal strength (as is the squat) and it has 0% chance of injury for your back, the crunch could never make that claim.
I will start with my first thoughts based on what I’ve learned over five years: He’s not wrong about the compound exercises building strength, but every other trainer I’ve worked with (and Arnold in his encyclopedia) include isolation exercises as part of the workout. So I’m sensing zeal – educated zeal but still zeal – for a particular school of thought that works for him.
1 hour, 46 minutes ago - Reply Like
Profile picture of Brad Collins
Most of what you are doing are compound movements. The guy did a hack job of copy and paste from somewhere and really showed he knows NOTHING about what he is talking about. Here on MBN, we only express what I do and I recommend, but bodybuilding is not a cookie cutter sport. What works for some may not for others. Its about finding what gives the best results to each body type. Isolated movements, control, proper form, and using different variations of drop setting, pyramiding, and standard rotations is what works for most. Also, what you put in your body has the biggest impact on how your body will progress and look. Not saying that this person is wrong, but its quite clear that he just copied this from someones blog or forum.
26 minutes ago - Reply Delete Like
Profile picture of Doug Hampton
Totally agree Brad. Flys are a excellent shaper. I am not a fan of dumbbell flys as they put too much stress on the shoulders and rotator cuff. Flys on the fly machine or standing cable are a stable compound movement for inner, outer, and wide chest muscle groups. Bench press is good, but if you look at any of the pros, most don’t even do bench press. Using dumbells ensures equal weight distribution and not as much stress on the rotator either. When doing bench, most old school guys like myself use the smith machine for incline and flat. As for crunches, there are far better ways to work the abs, but I wouldn’t abandon them. I put them in a rotation. I use the ab wheel, crunch machine, tricep pull down rope on my knees, and standard crunches. He gave advice that might work for him and his bodytype, but to say that is the holly grail is just ignorant. The advice we offer is just that. Its advice. You have to try and experiment to see what gives you the best pumps and gets you the most gains. Remember, diet, nutrition, and supplements are 80% of bodybuilding. Not paying attention to the micro nutrients will all but ensure very little results, and take 6 times as long to achieve. Burnout usually is the end result.
19 minutes ago - Reply Like
Profile picture of Dominic
Okay, to piggy back off of Brad and Doug, they spoke pretty much exactly what you have heard me and all of us say over and over. Thought the email was helpful, but for me, I wouldn’t subscribe to just about any of it. Most of your movements are compound, so he kind of lost me from the start. Second, without him knowing what your end goal is, how can one offer advice? You have to train, eat, and supplement to the goal you have. Bodybuilders eat, train, and supplement completely different than cross fit athletes. Same is true for lineman verses quarterbacks. The discipline doesn’t stop when you walk out of a completed workout. Actually, that is when it truly starts. Think of it like this. Do you think that ANY Olympic athlete trains an hour a day, 4 days a week? Hell no. Same principle here. Training in the kitchen is the true key to unlocking the mighty tiger within. Mixing up your routine with compounds, isolates, and rotation changes are vital. I would take his advice and apply some of it if it works for you, just like any of the advice offered here.
Discussion Item: I got this response from a good friend overseas after he watched the Chapter 7 video and a few others on my channel. If there’s one thing I know from doing this for five years, it’s that EVERYONE’s got an opinion they are convinced is the right one (yes, you MBN folks do it too, ha ha). I’m not looking for “Wow, he’s totally wrong, lose that friend!” I’m just looking for your thoughts on his advice.
*****
In my opinion you should stop doing [fly exercises]. They have very little benefit and for the amount of time they take you are better served using that time to do a compound exercise.
In fact, with the exception of maybe the rear delt fly (which will help promote a stable and healthy shoulder) I recommend you drop all of the isolation exercises (curls, leg extensions, over head tricep press, etc.). These exercises have very little benefit to your goal of losing weight and developing more muscle mass as they develop very little muscle mass.
Instead of isolation movements I would suggest filling your program exclusively with compound exercises as they will work more muscles in the same amount of time. Isolation exercises really can be helpful after you have developed a strong foundation in training and can be useful in correcting aesthetic issues or strength imbalances, but they are mostly a waste of time until you have developed a strong foundation.
My suggestion is to base your program around big compound exercises. The squat, the bench press, the standing overhead press, and the deadlift are all exercises that will help you develop a great deal of strength and muscle mass quickly. Use the leg press sparingly. Squat. Squat a lot. There is a reason it is called the king of exercises. Squatting frequently will bring you more results than ANY amount of leg presses, leg extensions, and leg curls. Lose the calf raises also, squats will make your calves big. I haven’t done a calf raise in 5 years and my calves are almost 20″.
Squat more. Do body weight squats. Got an extra 60 seconds do a set of 10 body weight squats. They add up throughout the day.
Barbell squat more. A lot more. Make it a personal goal to barbell squat 3 times a week. You don’t have to do a lot of weight, even just the bar if you want, but getting better at the squat will make you better at everything in life. Here is a sample starting squat routine:
Monday. 5 sets of 8 with just the bar
Wednesday. 8 sets of 1 with 75lbs (bar plus 15 on each side)
Friday. 3 sets of 3 with 95lbs (bar plus 25 on each side)
Each week add 10 lbs (first week would be 55lbs, 85lbs, 105lbs respectively).
Make sure you have good form and are squatting as deep as possible ass to grass or at least below parallel. Point your toes out 10 or 15 degrees and try driving your knees out to the side more, this will open your hips and give you room to get your body to get between your legs.
Bent over row
Bench press
Deadlift
Standing overhead press
SQUATS
Lunges
Pull ups (lat pull downs until you can do them)
Broad jumps
The above are all good examples of exercises you should be using as a foundation for your program. If you really want to do a fly, do a couple extra sets of bench press instead.
Ok I’m about to step off my soap box but u want to add one more thing, lose the crunch. The plank is a far more effective exercise for developing abdominal strength (as is the squat) and it has 0% chance of injury for your back, the crunch could never make that claim.
I will start with my first thoughts based on what I’ve learned over five years: He’s not wrong about the compound exercises building strength, but every other trainer I’ve worked with (and Arnold in his encyclopedia) include isolation exercises as part of the workout. So I’m sensing zeal – educated zeal but still zeal – for a particular school of thought that works for him.
1 hour, 46 minutes ago - Reply Like
Profile picture of Brad Collins
Most of what you are doing are compound movements. The guy did a hack job of copy and paste from somewhere and really showed he knows NOTHING about what he is talking about. Here on MBN, we only express what I do and I recommend, but bodybuilding is not a cookie cutter sport. What works for some may not for others. Its about finding what gives the best results to each body type. Isolated movements, control, proper form, and using different variations of drop setting, pyramiding, and standard rotations is what works for most. Also, what you put in your body has the biggest impact on how your body will progress and look. Not saying that this person is wrong, but its quite clear that he just copied this from someones blog or forum.
26 minutes ago - Reply Delete Like
Profile picture of Doug Hampton
Totally agree Brad. Flys are a excellent shaper. I am not a fan of dumbbell flys as they put too much stress on the shoulders and rotator cuff. Flys on the fly machine or standing cable are a stable compound movement for inner, outer, and wide chest muscle groups. Bench press is good, but if you look at any of the pros, most don’t even do bench press. Using dumbells ensures equal weight distribution and not as much stress on the rotator either. When doing bench, most old school guys like myself use the smith machine for incline and flat. As for crunches, there are far better ways to work the abs, but I wouldn’t abandon them. I put them in a rotation. I use the ab wheel, crunch machine, tricep pull down rope on my knees, and standard crunches. He gave advice that might work for him and his bodytype, but to say that is the holly grail is just ignorant. The advice we offer is just that. Its advice. You have to try and experiment to see what gives you the best pumps and gets you the most gains. Remember, diet, nutrition, and supplements are 80% of bodybuilding. Not paying attention to the micro nutrients will all but ensure very little results, and take 6 times as long to achieve. Burnout usually is the end result.
19 minutes ago - Reply Like
Profile picture of Dominic
Okay, to piggy back off of Brad and Doug, they spoke pretty much exactly what you have heard me and all of us say over and over. Thought the email was helpful, but for me, I wouldn’t subscribe to just about any of it. Most of your movements are compound, so he kind of lost me from the start. Second, without him knowing what your end goal is, how can one offer advice? You have to train, eat, and supplement to the goal you have. Bodybuilders eat, train, and supplement completely different than cross fit athletes. Same is true for lineman verses quarterbacks. The discipline doesn’t stop when you walk out of a completed workout. Actually, that is when it truly starts. Think of it like this. Do you think that ANY Olympic athlete trains an hour a day, 4 days a week? Hell no. Same principle here. Training in the kitchen is the true key to unlocking the mighty tiger within. Mixing up your routine with compounds, isolates, and rotation changes are vital. I would take his advice and apply some of it if it works for you, just like any of the advice offered here.